Climb Malawi Fundraiser-Seattle March 2025
Host: Crystal Hudelson (Rock Rose Blog, LLC and the Washington Climbers Coalition)
Speakers:
Sof Petros (Out in the Wild and Edge Outdoors)
Eric Ballentine (Minority Veterans of America)
Kasim Carter (Outdoor Afro)
Phillip Henderson (Full Circle Expeditions, Inc.)
Chevon Powell (Golden Bricks Events and Refuge Outdoor Festival)
Crystal Rose H. (she/her)
Hello good people of the world. I promised after the Climb Malawi event that I would try my best to record and release the all Black Pacific Northwest panel that was going to be happening that night. And guess what? I have it here for you today. The event went very well. It was in March of 2025.
The event itself was really wonderful and the vision that I had for it went without a hitch. Just basically a table fair with some key community partners.
We had about 18 tablers come through, so thank you all for coming to table and talk to the community. Get the word out about that good work that you’re doing as well. We really appreciate seeing you. And for me, it felt like a big party, a big reunion. Yes, I was running around doing everything on the organizing aspect with some of the Global Climbing Initiative people. But I did have time to say hello to a lot of people that I know and adore in the community in the Seattle area in the climbing realm. And thank you all for coming and making this really, really great.
We did end up raising a couple thousand dollars for the Global Climbing Initiative, and that will go to Climb Malawi to help with infrastructure for climbing and gear and all that good stuff.
The Global Climbing Initiative has been doing some wonderful work, so definitely check them out. And thank you so much for honoring me with guiding the vision and guiding the experience that everyone was going to. And one of the biggest events that I personally have actually put together, I was the forerunner, the main person on this project. But a big shout out to Dani as well of the Global Climbing Initiative and Veronica, who were also very, very much a part of all the organizing aspects. I was basically a contractor on this. I was helping out off the Washington Climbers Coalition side, but more importantly I also was doing it on the side as my Rock Rose Blog LLC company as well and what better platform than this one to go ahead and release the all Black Pacific Northwest Panel so that y’all don’t miss out on any of that discussion because I thought it was massively interesting.
The audience was very, very engaged. So there’s clapping in between every single question that is answered, because everyone there had such reverence for the speakers, myself included.
And that all star lineup with those organizers: I was starstruck personally and I know these organizers in my own life but the work that they do is so important so above there are links with each person’s name and organization so that you can do more research on seeing what they have going on because they’re doing some exciting things. Sign up for them, donate to them, support them in general because they deserve our recognition respect and our money.
I did make it so that there are different colors per speaker so you can tell who is speaking, but if the color is not your thing you can visit the Substack article format to read it there. We want you to be involved with them and we want you to recognize them in the community and give them their dues.
And a special thanks to Phil Henderson, who I cold called and he said, “I just want to be involved”. And it went from there, from him being on the panel to hosting the actual talk with Genevive and Mario, which was really wonderful as well and happened after this panel, which unfortunately I did not record. And then also thank you to Genevive and Mario for coming all the way to Seattle to talk to our community, to show your wonderful film of Climb Malawi documentary. And a special shout out to Mario for recording this panel as well. I was planning on recording it myself, but I am really not set up like that, y’all. And he had the setup.
So with that, enjoy the panel.
You can find this on Spotify as an episode or you can go to Substack as well for the video. I am also on WordPress. You can find me at http://www.rockrose.blog and also see the written article form of this or on Substack.
Enjoy.
Dani Dobrot (Global Climbing Initiative)
…Genevive and Mario to locations. We also make, you know, encourage those trainings. We provide grants for projects that are social, environmental, and economic and creative. And then we also do your gear distribution So look us up. You can just kind of go to our website. We’ve also partnered with the Washington Climbers Coalition and the Bouldering Project for this event, as well as all these fantastic tablings. So thank you all for coming.
So in that, I’m gonna have Crystal come and introduce herself and all of these panelists. So Crystal works for the Washington Climbers Coalition and Crystal is really the person behind this entire event tonight.
Crystal Hudelson (Rock Rose Blog, LLC and Washington Climbers Coalition)
Thank you, Dani. And Dani has also put a lot of good work into this organization too, so thank you. Thank you everyone for coming and of course we’re here to see these wonderful people and all of their wonderful work that they have been doing here in the Pacific Northwest. So welcome to our Community Connection Panel.
One more note, we still have raffle tickets for sale as well. You’ll have a little bit of a chance after this panel to purchase more. And of course, that goes to the Global Climbing Initiative for continued crag development, outdoor climbing opportunities, and upgrades to the climbing center in Malawi So with that, we’re going to get started.
Are you all ready?
So my name is Crystal, I use she, her pronouns, and today I am representing Rock Rose Blog, it’s a consulting company for DEI, locally here in Washington. And we’ll just have you all go right down the line and introduce yourself, your name, maybe your organization, and anything else you’d like to share.
Sof Petros (Out in the Wild and Edge Outdoors)
Hi everyone, my name is Sof I use she/they pronouns and I’m representing two organizations today. One, Out in the Wild which is a Queer owned and Queer affinity guide service that focuses on technical climbing education, instruction, guide development, and then also Edge Outdoors, which is a Black women owned, and led nonprofit that works to increase leadership and representation of women and gender non conforming in snow sports.
Eric Ballentine (Minority Veterans of America)
You’ve got to clap that. *applause* Yea! That’s a lot of amazing stuff. My name is Eric Ballentine; I go by they/them pronouns. I am here on behalf of Minority Veterans of America.
We are an organization that serves veterans. But we serve veterans predominantly from marginalized communities, focusing on Black and Brown communities, Queer communities, and women veterans, specifically because the identities that we hold uniquely shape what our experiences are like in the military. And so we often tend to disassociate from that. So it’s really about bringing veterans back to have a community that they can call their own.
Kasim Carter (Outdoor Afro)
My name is Kasim Carter. He/him pronouns. I represent Outdoor Afro. We are a national organization. We basically inspire leadership in the outdoor community and do a lot of things as far as outdoor events. Around the country we have over 100 leaders. We’re in about 33-34 states right now. We’re constantly growing and continuing to grow. We just lead folks out in different sorts of adventures in the outdoors encourage Black people to get to the outdoors and get out there and do things.
Phillip Henderson (Full Circle Expeditions, Inc.)
Good evening, my name is Philip Henderson. I’m representing Full Circle Expeditions. I was the leader of the first all-Black team to Summit Mountain Everest. Usually we are attended in
California but I now reside in southwest Colorado.
My organization, Full Circle Expedition really just focuses on everybody. We focus on everybody, but we prioritize people of color, especially kids, because we just want to expose them to everything that we all do and that we know that we can be doing outside. You’ll hear a little bit about my globalization of the outdoors. So that’s pretty much it.
Chevon Powell (Golden Bricks Events and Refuge Outdoor Festival)
Howdy y’all. Chevon Powell, She/her pronouns; founder of Gold Bricks Events and Refuge Outdoor Festival. We are an organization producing events geared toward BIPOC communities and the outdoors, creating safety, physical and emotional safety, belonging, and joy.
And I’m from Texas.
Crystal
Thank you so much for sharing, and I am very excited to hear more from these panelists. I cannot overstate the work that these wonderful people do in our community for our community. Thank you so much. So the question is, how does your organization foster and grow community connection, and what does community connection mean to you?
And we’re going to start with Phil because I know this was advertised as an all Black Pacific Northwest community organizing space. But Phil, you have a lot of connections here.
Phillip Henderson (11:24)
I’m like, all time for a community connection. And I just mentioned a little, a minute ago about globalizing. And to me, when I think of community, I don’t just think of us, Black people. I don’t just think of San Diego, California. I don’t just think of the United States. I literally think globally because I’ve been able to travel through the outdoors in my experience.
I’ve actually never been a tourist, to be honest about it. I’ve lived in three different countries. I’ve lived in Kenya for two years, I’ve lived in Chile for three years, and I’ve been in Nepal 13 or 14 times. So to me, that’s my community. These people that I spend time in the mountains with, that I help train and do all the kind of things. So everybody, if you speak a different language, you come from a different place, it doesn’t matter.
We are all connected to the outdoors and so that’s really what I want to focus on. The environment itself, we all belong to it. We come from it.
And we need to protect it, but we don’t do that if we don’t educate everybody. We don’t connect everybody. And we’ve all been so disconnected from the environment and the outdoors, we don’t even know what outdoors means anymore. It’s not just recreation. And so I really try to just get everybody into…get in where you fit in, right? Meet people where they are. And some folks heard me say this last night, I don’t care if it’s sitting on a park bench birding or if it’s climbing Mt Everest Anything in between that, get out in the world and that’s what we’re going to help. We just connect people.
Crystal Hudelson (13:14)
Anyone else like to chime in as well.
Kasim Carter (13:17)
Can you guys hear me okay? Yeah, Outdoor Afro similar to Phil was talking about the outdoors can mean pretty much anything to anybody. We’re just encouraging, we recognize that there is a certain healing element to being into that into outdoors to go out there and doing things. Like I mentioned earlier, we have over 32 networks around the country and the way they reach out is when we bring one new volunteer leader like myself, we kind of tap into the communities that we live in. So I just relocated out here from the East Coast, so I’m out in Washington now. I’ve been tapping into the community out here, encouraging them to do…I mean, one of first things I ask when I have my first event is what do you guys like to do? I enjoy hiking, backpacking, kayaking,ncamping, just about anything outdoors, I’m gonna at least try. But sometimes it’s birdwatching. Sometimes it’s…we have a leader in Chicago. I don’t think they’ve ever done anything other than cycling events. I have a leader in Boston, she does ice climbing events. People in Florida, are like, “we don’t hike. It’s just hot, too humid”. They do swimming events and kayaking events and things like that. So I think the whole idea is just to reach out and find people, let them just to come outside to encourage the kids and everybody to come out and enjoy nature in whichever way they feel is appropriate to them and let them know that it’s okay and it’s safe to do so. A lot of times, especially in our community, in our past, it’s kind of been taboo to kind of go into the outdoors, go hiking. I get it all the time, when you go out there hiking by yourself, yeah, if you can do that now, it’s free.
*Audience laughter*
But a lot of people are starting to fear while going out to some of these places. So part of the idea of this organization is to encourage people to get out there; make it safe for them and realize that it’s safe and to spread it throughout their community. I always tell them, you guys can come out and do this hike with me or camping with me, but then I want you to go back and bring your family and take your kids out on hiking with your grandma and do something out, inside of your community as well. So that’s how we get it out there.
Eric Ballentine (15:44)
Yeah, so I’m 40. I’m 43. So like I grew up in the 80s and 90s, right? Being a latch key kid, like that was just the norm, right? And that comes from a place of: you’re going home by yourself. But at the same time, Ms. Hattie down the street, she might not talk to your mom at all, but she knows when you actin’ a fool, right? But also at the same time, if you’re locked out of your house, you had an unsafe situation, you can go to this person. So for us as an organization, a lot of our community is revolving around the same. We serve Black and Brown communities. We serve Queer folks. We serve women, particularly from the veteran community. And that’s significantly important because, let’s just call it really quick, the military has a problem with sexual violence, especially against women. We have issues with, I mean…you turn on the news, you know what’s going on with the military and Queer folks right now. And then with all of that, there’s always racism and like erasure that’s happened long before Trump came into play. So for us as a community, it’s really about pulling people in. And we have very strict standards in terms of what it means to be a member of our organization. It’s not about you just respecting Black and Brown folks. It’s not just about you respecting women. It’s not just about you respecting all the people that we serve. You have to respect each and every one of those groups individually, and as a collective because you come into my community; I can’t guarantee things because people always act a fool, but at the same time like you should have a sense of confidence when you come into our community to say “hey I feel safe here; I feel heard; I feel seen.” And so that’s always the focal point of all the things that we do. Most people that come to us, they’re coming to us because they have had a negative experience in another organization. And so we’re really revolved around safety, belonging, and then always talking to that community that you’re also a part of, right? Like, I’m not just serving these folks, I’m a part of the community. Everybody that works at our organization or is a part of one or more of those communities, right? Intersectionality is a thing that’s a lot more important.
So ensuring like, hey, I’m not going to say I understand because everybody has their own each individual circumstance, but you have a place to where you can safely share your story if you feel comfortable to. And just be there and be present and enjoy the things that we do. And the things that we do are based on what the community is telling us.
Sof Petros (18:35)
If we’re going down the line, I can share. Yeah, I think that’s something that I really appreciate about a couple of programs that I work with, and notably Edge, is just a recognition that a lot of these experiences are valuable, but they’re not valuable in isolation. So learning to ski or to ride as an adult. So a lot of our programs are focused on women and Queer folk who are never learning as adults have never had the opportunity to slide on snow and experience how silly and fun and wonderful that is, or like very early and have had a lot of negative experiences outside and it’s not just about like: here’s a pass to the mountain have fun you know your way is paved but thinking about the actual value of doing that over multiple days, multiple weeks in a community that looks like you can support you in that way that that connection is fostered in those moments and in those like multiple days and weeks and in the time to come. Those are experiences that allow us to actually like tap more fully into presence and not just get an experience but also think about what are the things that allow us to maximize our potential in terms of full participation: feeling psychologically safe, emotionally safe, understood by the people that you’re with, especially as we’re taking on objective risk, we’re just learning new things about our bodies or ourselves. or just environmental hazard: being like cold, hungry, hungry, lonely, frustrated as you’re figuring something out. And the value of doing that alongside people who look like you, can support you, as that continues forward rather than just getting the opportunity to do it in and of itself. I think that also from just more holistically and thinking about for me, a lot of being in community is about opting into that.
And so rather than having a group of people who just nominally share something in common, we like to climb or we like to ski, we have a certain demographic background, a shared racial or ethnic identity, that there’s more that we have in common that we’re actually choosing to come together and kind of stand alongside each other, being that often around shared values and wanting to maximize the full participation of other people in those spaces. And so I think a common question just we’ll ask is like, what’s going to help you be your fullest self here? What’s going to maximize your participation? What’s going to keep you from being your fullest self in a space? And I think that’s a big part of not just getting people together because they seem like they should be aligned based on identity experience or we enjoy the same activity, but we’re doing those things and changing behaviors to really bring folks in.
Chevon Powell
I’ll just say I co-sign on everything that has been said. And for us specifically with Golden Bricks: community is essential in what we do because we’re building a more inclusive community. So, you know, we develop a robust partner network because we can’t do this in a silo, I think someone said. So to create belonging, we have to know that safety is an important piece of belonging. Being celebrated as part of belonging and part of community. And so that’s our main pillars to address that community. We have to do this together because we won’t be in a better place unless we’re in it together.
Crystal Hudelson (22:21)
Thank you. I’ve enjoyed every minute of this.
I do have another question, follow up as well. A lot of times we do find ourselves in shared space, right? Sometimes specifically POC or person of color spaces. And so do you have any advice for organizations on how to include specifically the B in BIPOC aka Black folks?
Chevon Powell (22:53)
It’s intentionality. Like, you have to call out anti-blackness immediately. And if you’re not doing that, then we’re not feeling safe. I say, if there’s no B, if there’s no B in I, don’t say I’ll talk. Period. That’s it.
Kasim Carter (23:13)
With Outdoor Afro our focus is specifically Black. It’s not BIPOC or anything else. And that’s one way that we maintain that focus. That’s what we’re trying to do is to get Black people out. It’s very focused on that. However, one of the things that I’ve done and a lot of other leaders have done is join with other organizations. Every year I do two events with Latino Outdoors, Outdoor Asian, this year we’ll be doing an event. We did it last year with Outdoor Asian Latino Outdoors and Outdoor Afro, going to, within the Nature Conservancy, going to San Juan Islands and going to one of the islands that they own, the Yellow Island, it’s called Yellow Island.
So doing joint events with organizations that are very specific as far as their focus, Latino Outdoors, Asian Outdoors, what have you. I think, but also having that focus on specifically on Black people. Because sometimes, especially within our community, there can be some distrust. There can be people uncomfortable if they go to an event and it’s just, and I’m the only Black person there. and everybody else is something else. We have all of us…I mean, I can’t tell you many times, but people are really comfortable just knowing that…I I’ve had people that were nervous to bring their, maybe their spouse or their partner. I’m like: you bring them along absolutely. And as long as the understanding is that this event is focused specifically on Black people, trying to get Black people into the outdoors and joining the outdoors and spending time outside.
Eric Ballentine
I’ll also say, unless you’re gonna cut me a check: don’t put me at the forefront of trying to recruit Black folks for your organization. And I see it happen time and time again, or like tokenizing Black folks. Like, I need, there is a threshold of guidance that, or things that I need you to know before we start having a conversation about how to include Black people into your organization. That comes a lot, unfortunately that comes a lot from POC organizations and this is why we use the word intentionally when we talk about BI POC because the reality is that it’s not the same and that’s okay. Like you can understand that and live with that. I’m not saying like things are a hierarchy but the reality of the reason we use Black, Indigenous and people of color is because Black people and Indigenous folks have a unique experience in relationship to America than a lot of other POC folks. So it’s really important that we not just put the labor, the emotional and physical and mental labor on Black folks and Indigenous folks.
Sof Petros (26:15)
Yeah, I think I’ll offer two things. One, I think in spaces that I’ve been in that are across the board, and I just want to give a real shout out. I think there is in the room Alpine Ascents that helps us out with this. But Edge is nominally for folks across racial and ethnic backgrounds, but actually just kind of put the B in BIPOC in terms of thinking about women specifically for this AIARE 1 affinity for like, avalanche education course.
Shout out to Mary and Alpine Ascent for the support with EDGE, as well as Brooklyn Bell and Emile Zynobia for helping us put that on a couple weeks ago at Mt. Baker, as thinking what are the ways that in an organization that is for folks across the board, we can think about elevating and creating spaces for Black women and Black Queer folk to get the certifications and leadership experience and expand, like to expand their leadership opportunities so that we’re thinking about who are the people that are going to teach, who are going to lead, and bring other folks up into this organization that we’re investing specifically in this pool of folks, not the expense of others, but really making sure that we maintain that leadership, understanding. It’s often Black women that are experiencing attrition in these spaces. They come in and don’t necessarily get to continue to rise. So how do we invest in their leadership?
And then I think for advice to organizations, that’s a second question.
Crystal Hudelson
We’re going to go into that.
Sof Petros
Oh, OK. I’ll hold my tongue.
Crystal Hudelson (27:43)
We can give Phil a chance to answer?
Phillip Henderson
Look, I’m gonna keep it real for you. I don’t really even use the acronym BIPOC
I’m not an acronym just like I say that I’m not a theory. I’m a person with experience and I want to tell my story.
For me, obviously, Black people, Indigenous people, Latino people, Native people, I don’t want to cut us short.
So let’s use what we are. Just use the word instead of an acronym.
Make people say it. The way that I try (and this is ice climbing customers) people were saying, hey, I want to learn how to ice climb, but I want to learn from people who look like me. How many people out there can teach ice climbing?
So that’s why I show up. Because I don’t want people to show up and be like, “well, nobody looks like me”. And then you have to go through these things that we’re talking about.
Skiing, backcountry skiing. If someone comes to me and says, hey, I want to do this or I want to learn this, Bop. I’m there. We need more of this. That’s why I’m here, because people need to know that it’s possible and that it’s needed as well. Go back to Black people and putting that to the forefront.
Again, I don’t put it to the forefront, if someone calls me and say, can you come visit a school in Boca Kentucky? I’m going to be there. Because those kids don’t see people like me. So if you expose them to that, it’s planting a seed to them. They’re like, oh, OK. People like me do do this. And if I say BI POC to that second grader, they don’t know what that is.
So it’s about showing up, it’s about saying much more because we can’t change that. Like that’s why I said, I’m not a BI POC: I’m a Black person.
Crystal Hudelson (30:13)
Thank you all. Right? And don’t be afraid to say Black people. We’re Black and we’re proud. Also, a shout out to Mary Brown that Sof was talking about. Where is Mary? Thank you for also working for the community as well. Stop by the Alpine Ascent’s Table to go talk to Mary Brown about the BIPOC cohort.
So with that, I guess we’re gonna circle back to Sof to ask one last question and then we’ll have a little bit of time for audience questions. If anyone would like to have any questions answered. So Sof, how can the outdoor community support you and or your work?
It’s your time to shine.
Sof Petros (30:57)
Oh wow, no pressure. I think a big thing is just the question that I think is largely rhetorical, but asking from organizations and other groups to get very serious about whether the inclusion of Black folks in programs or in leadership is coming from a fear, like a place of fear, that we’re going to be criticized or canceled or critiqued for not including the leadership perspectives of Black folks. Or is it because you’re genuinely excited about what that will bring to the table and how that would change your organizing and your organization? I think there’s a lot of groups that just bring folks in largely to tokenize them out of nervousness that they will not seem like diverse or cool enough. And so just kind of bring folks in as a face rather than thinking, wow, this space is lacking the leadership of Black people and it would be really cool if they were here because they would make that space richer and more exciting and creative and would bring a perspective we don’t currently have rather than operating out of fear. And I think that’s just a question that I have asked other people to sit with. And I’ll just leave it at that.
Eric Ballentine (32:10)
One thing I’ll say really quickly because it’s just, it doesn’t answer the question directly but it’s super important. I heard a quote today, I just want to read it to you, it said, “All men benefit from the actions of violent men. It keeps women in check, it allows men to perform the barest minimum and still feel good about themselves. The existence of violent men grants good men awards for basic decency.”
I think it’s really important to talk about, especially when it comes to Black women, right? We know that Black folks in America have a really, we have a f*cking really difficult time, right? And so when I think about that, that conversation is often, most often, it’s centered around men, right? The reality of situation is that Black women have a really f*cking hard time.
So I’m just going to be real quick and I’m just going to say it, right? Protect Black women, right? If you see someone putting a little bit too much base in their voice at the store, on the trail, at the crag: stop for a minute. Analyze the situation and say, is this problematic, right? Is this person coming at them because they’re a Black woman or would they also talk to me that way, right? It’s really important because when you break all of these things down, right? How systemic oppression truly works, is that we target all these different groups; and it gets to a point to where we’re stuck in our own box that we’re not seeing in people’s existence. And the people that feel that the most are Black women and Black trans women. Black trans women are women, just to keep that in mind, but I also want to highlight my Queer folks, especially when it comes to them being gay and AFAB That’s it. That’s all I’m going to say. I’ll leave it with that. That’s what my organization does. And we do that for all communities. But I also want to give a shout out to these Black women on stage for still willing to be out here and do these great things, even though America kind of has a tendency to say, f*ck you. And I’m just saying, I’ll protect you. I’ll look at you. That’s it.
Crystal Hudelson (34:20)
Sorry.
And can I jump in for a second AFAB for those of you that may be curious is assigned female at birth.
Eric Ballentine (34:33)
Correct. You killin’ it, girl! Oh! I love it!
Crystal Hudelson (34:38)
Sorry Kasim go ahead
Kasim Carter (34:41)
I think with Outdoor Afro and any organization, I think just encouraging people to go out there and try something new. So look at some of our organizations, support our organizations. All of us have budgets. We all have financial goals and needs and things of that nature. And as we know, the current administration coming in, a lot of those things are being cut. Just like Phil said, doesn’t like BIPOC term, I don’t like DEI as a term, tell me exactly what about diversity you don’t like. What is it about inclusion you don’t like? Make them say those letters, let them read them out exactly because they’re just throwing it all in, it’s DEI, it’s woke or it’s this. We need to support ourselves, need to, I mean, we, with Outdoor Afro most of our events, I’d say 99 % of our events are going to be free. We don’t charge people to come out on our hikes, camping trips or anything like that and it’s all paid for: so that takes money so supporting our organization, all of these organizations, is very important. You can go to outdoorafro.org and donate.
You can encourage your businesses that you work with, encourage other organizations. If you have an organization that does climbing or what have you. If you want to bring more Black people into climbing, maybe go out and find some sort of a Black organization and offer some sort of a discount to their classes or something like that. with regards to what your business can offer, we’ve had lots of sponsors, we’ve had the Mountaineers, we’ve had REI, we’ve had a lot of people that sponsored, but a lot of those things are going to be cut by a lot of companies and definitely by the government so getting out there and actually financially supporting these organizations and sending some money their way and let them know that they are important and what they’re doing is worthwhile.
Phillip Henderson (36:41)
We can all use some money
But you know, I mean, it’s really about supporting people. It’s about supporting all people, one being that look like us. And believe me, I’ve known this for a while. I’ve been looking for people like this for quite a while, and they didn’t exist. But I always knew that they existed. They just needed an in.
Sometimes when you have, you were talking about Black men, Black women, but in this industry, I think that sometimes they’re still scared of Black people -Black men with experience. It’s like, oh, what is that, right? How can I relate to that person? Is that person taking my job? All these different things. Now believe me, I came into the industry when it was “D”. It was diversity. And even then when I came into it, I don’t think I ever used the word before.
So I was brought into that. It wasn’t what I came into the industry for. But it’s there. But when people ask you for…you’re talking about pulling people in, there’s something I tell people is: you can utilize me, don’t use me. There’s a difference there. That difference is when you feel like you’re being used, being pulled in just because.
But that might be pulled in the right way because I do have the experience. People know that. But why do you want me to sit here? Because if you just want me to sit there and not talk and not show the experience that I have, then that’s something different. That’s me being used. But if you want to utilize me, then I can build a community of people with your support. And that’s all I ever really wanted to do was just have the support to do the work that I’ve always wanted to do.
I see that as needed and now people are seeing that as needed. So that’s why I say, yeah, support what we do. Outdoor Afro when Outdoor Afro was just coming up, I ran a trip for their leaders to Kilimanjaro back in 2018, because I know that we need leaders that are experienced. I know that if I don’t go into schools right now, that 10 years from now, we’re going to be sitting here talking about the same thing, because people are coming in going: I want people to look like me.
But we don’t have them.
So it’s that important for us to support each other, regardless of where you’re coming from, what you look like, all of those things. But I also know that as Black people, as Black children, Black and Brown people, we’re probably the least connected to the outdoors for various reasons. That’s a whole other story. I work, again, I worked for NOLS for a long time. I worked in the outdoors.
People can’t say that I’m not willing to work with anybody or that I can’t work with anybody. But when I choose to work with my community, that’s a problem?
No, it’s not a problem, it’s a need. And so that’s why I work in that.
Thank you.
Chevon Powell (40:06)
I’ll just say for our work we do a lot with organizations and partners and I always start with checking their why. We’re not a box. We want you to invest in us and that goes with it all, just giving us money. It’s also hiring us. It’s also creating space at the table, or letting us create our own table. Investing not in only our labor but our rest and our recovery from the systems that we live in.
So I would say to each of you, if you’re in an organization, check your why every day because it’s needed for transformation.
Crystal Hudelson
Thank so much for all your experience and your wisdom and being willing to come up here and share; truly. So we’re going to take a few minutes for audience questions. If you have a question, just raise your hand and I will go ahead and call on you and repeat it so everyone can hear it.
Don’t be shy now.
Yes, in the Outdoor Afro shirt
Person in the Outdoor Afro shirt (41:15)
Yeah! Represent!
Kasim Carter (41:18)
He is not a plant, I promise.
Person in the Outdoor Afro shirt
I have question for Phil. What is your favorite outdoor sport and was that your first outdoor sport?
Phillip Henderson
Definitely. Definitely wasn’t my first sport. Maybe my first outdoor sport.
My favorite is, skiing. Nothing else will get me up at three o’clock in the morning, except skiing.
Okay, yep. That was easy.
Crystal Hudelson (42:02)
Short and sweet.
Yes, in the nice pattern.
Person in the Nice Pattern
I think we talked a lot about the challenges that you all are facing. What are some of the parts of what you do that bring you joy? If there’s a specific example or just generally those small moments that keep you going through the challenging part. We want to repeat that for you.
Eric Ballentine
Yeah, absolutely.
What are some positives that we do? Is there something that I’m crazy about? So my work is…we’ve been around for seven years. We came out with a sense of urgency just based on two of our founders had a really bad experience with other veteran organizations. And so we have worked really, really, really f*cking hard over these past seven years. And so last year in October, we opened up a transitional house exclusively for Queer veterans. That’s the first program of its kind anywhere in the country. It is not federally funded. So we’re doing that. And I think the big thing is the work that we do is hard. But it also reminds me that I’m just not this f*cking geeky person that everybody, seems like from all walks of life, people are saying, hey, one you don’t exist, right? There’s no such thing as non binary. Two like your problems aren’t that bad like you’re getting stuck up with the past but I have emails and phone calls of people saying hey I really I really need community; and then actually showing up for them and being with them is like I have not gotten this ever. And so it’s just like there’s the beauty in that, right? The frustration is I’m doing a job that I’m working, trying so hard hoping that my job doesn’t exist. But the reality of situation is this is a perpetual thing and making those connections with folks, seeing the results getting people off the street that have been through numerous housing challenges through their life and actually finding a place that works with them and the identities that they hold, ALL of the identities that they hold. And just seeing that response, it’s a beautiful day. I have to love that work. I am a person of the people, right? And so just seeing the individual growth of people is something to celebrate every day.
Sof Petros (44:38)
I think on the theme of just like individual growth, it’s really exciting to see folks learn a new skill and get it to click. Like, that is so satisfying. Like, I got it. And you’re like, you got it! And you have this moment together that…especially deepening someone’s connection to a sport or to the outdoors that you really care about.
And for me is watching how fast that occurs in learning environments that really celebrate the whole person when I think like, gosh, that took me so long to figure out that climbing skill; or to learn this thing in my skiing. And then you see folks that you’re teaching in an environment that feels really inclusive and they’re like, that was easy. You’re like, that was easy. It could have been that simple. That feels like it’s very healing and very exciting.
And yesterday, I didn’t answer, but I was asked my favorite outdoor activity. And I really like to nap outside. I really like the feeling of working really hard to get somewhere and be like, I think we have 20 minutes. Or we’re at the summit. We can take some time and take my hat or my muff and put it on my head and just knock out. There’s lots of photos of me in the alpine taking naps. And not just that feeling of like, calm. Like, wow, I was competent enough to get here.
I feel peaceful and restful enough to just soak in the sounds and vitamin D and relax. That keeps me going and it makes me want to be more efficient with my system so I can take longer naps. It’s been working.
*Audience laughter*
Kasim Carter (46:16)
For me, I would say it’s the joy that people get, especially when it’s their first time. I have just a couple of examples. Just last week, before I had surgery, I had a snowshoeing event. I had a woman who…she came on one of my first hikes that I did out here. She’s a senior, so she’s in her low 70s, I believe. Retired, just trying to get back outdoors. She came on my first hike, when I came out here and pushed through it. Was about five miles, right? But then doing this snow shoe, she came out and said I’m gonna try; I’m gonna challenge myself. And she just had so much fun. And just seeing the look on her face was just like, wow, this is what this is all about.
Last year I did a camping trip every year and had some time to bring their kids, their family, whatever it’s one family, brought their little son with them and obviously where we are there’s no Wi-Fi or anything so his phone is not working and he’s just complaining. The whole first day like “this is gonna suck”. By the time that trip ended, that camp trip, he was singing at the campfire. He was bringing up the song. We’d never sing at campfires. Was bringing up songs and he was just having so much fun. He totally forgot about his phone and everything. And his parents came, father came over and thanked me. He said, “that boy never gets off his phone”. So now he’s actually out here enjoying himself and running around. So introducing something like that to somebody that’s never had…done it before and seeing when it clicks and that they really enjoy being outside and doing something, that does it every time
Chevon Powell (48:01)
I’m a small business and I think for me the joy is workload that we have in being a small business. And it’s not just about the money. It’s actually about…we know about at least five people that have started new outdoor businesses because of coming to our events or connecting at our partner network; folks that have changed careers. Outdoor Asian in Colorado started because a person came to Refuge Fest and went back to Colorado and started Outdoor Asian in Colorado. So the impact there is probably the thing that brings me the most joy. And we just realized that last year we have now gotten out over 12,000 people via the events that we’ve produced.
Audience (48:43)
Wow
Crystal Hudelson (48:51)
We might as well end on a high note, Phil. Would you like to…?
Phillip Henderson (48:55)
Honestly, there’s too many for me to even go down that path. One that I really want to, she just mentioned it…just kind of a ripple effect. And again, when I started in this industry, look, I worked for the NOLS, anybody know NOLS?
For six years, I was the only Black-American person that worked there. I’ve never had a student in an organization like that that looked like me. I never had a staff person that looked like me until I went to Kenya. So even just sitting in this room, last year, Mary hiked with me to Nepal.
I can go around and my cousin is sitting here right now. I haven’t seen my cousin in 30 years. That to me is a highlight for him to be in the room, to hear me talk about these things that I do. We grow together, we’re like this. So the ripple effect, I’m called every day, every one of them. Nowadays I’m being like, wow, this is happening. So staying in the industry long enough to see this change that’s going on and see people who are willing to put themselves out there and make this change, I’ve won the game.
Crystal Hudelson (50:20)
Thank you so much for your time, effort, energy, and attention. And we appreciate the work that you do. Keep at it. Hopefully, you’ll make some great connections here tonight. And thank you all for coming as well. That’s the end of our community connection panel. Let’s give them all a round of applause.
Crystal Rose H. (she/her) (50:46)
And there you have it. I hope this panel was everything that you were hoping it to be and illuminated some topics for you. If you’re interested as to why I went this route to have a particular panel like this, feel free to go on Substack or Spotify and look at the Climb Malawi Community Connection Panel episode as I do talk about this in a little bit more depth.
If this panel has awakened some curiosity in you concerning Black folks in climbing, I highly suggest looking at my podcast on Spotify or reading the article format on my website or sub stack or watching the video on sub stack on Black Hair in Climbing, an eight part series that does talk about Black hair in climbing. Substack video, Substack article, Spotify, Website
I also at this time have another article in the works, Black Hair in Climbing Continued. So keep an eye out for that one as well. And we will expand upon some of the topics that were touched on in the Black Hair and Climbing article.
A special thanks to the Washington Climbers Coalition and Seattle Bouldering Project for full on donating, and also for the following for raffles: Sterling Ropes, Edgeworks Climbing, Vertical World, Community Gearbox, On-site Physical Therapy, Rock Doc PT, Roosevelt Chiropractic and Massage, Rab, and Specialized Masochism.
Thank you all for donating to the raffle. Also, thank you to the Mountaineers for providing us with a space in which to gather; we do appreciate it.
And we’ll see you later, good people.
Rock Rose Blog, LLC 